Phoenix USB Clocker - Audio Science Review

[Peder]

You are one of these golden eared people who refuse the real world

Oh My God.....

Your lack of ability to understand written text.
AND,.being able to draw relevant conclusions is astonishingly low...

In other words non-existent..!!

I will comment more on your strange writing above when I have time.
BUT,.you can assume that I have 100% knowledge of what you bring up above.

In the meantime...
You can think about why InnuOs chose not to comment on you,.in your other thread on the same topic...

I understand why,.Do you..??

 

[Stebbo]

Oh My God.....

Your lack of ability to understand written text.
AND,.being able to draw relevant conclusions is astonishingly low...

In other words non-existent..!!

I will comment more on your strange writing above when I have time.
BUT,.you can assume that I have 100% knowledge of what you bring up above.

In the meantime...
You can think about why InnuOs chose not to comment on you,.in your other thread on the same topic...

I understand why,.Do you..??

I don’t care to be honest.
I know the reclocker is snake oil. It has been confirmed with extensive testing over on ASR. It goes against a mature technology that has been in use for years.

I think this sums it up nicely. A quote from a guy on another forum.

Middle-aged hi-fi people with disposable income, too much time on their hands and a ropey understanding of the technology enjoy finding solutions to non-existent problems.

 

[Peder]

I know the reclocker is snake oil. It has been confirmed with extensive testing over on ASR. It goes against a mature technology that has been in use for years.

OK,.so what I hear in my own music system,with my own ears,you rudely choose to just ignore.
DESPITE,.my experience,which I only slightly touched on in previous posts.

With your statement,.so I assume you have listened yourself.
IF NOT,.well then you embarrass yourself even more,.and just appear like a clown..!!
ESPECIALLY,.when you are so rude here on InnuO's own forum.
-------------------------------------------------------------
I wonder if @Stephen Healy wants to
comment on anything.
Personally,.I completely understand if
he doesn't.
-------------------------------------------------------------
How many times do you think we,.and I suppose InnuOs have read the same nonsense.
This from "the technical" narrow-minded people who walk around with their blinders on.

AND,.in your case,that you don't even hear a difference in sound quality between two quality ethernet-cables...

THAT,.says a lot about what level you are at.

You still have a lot to learn about high-quality music-systems,.everyone here who takes part in your argument probably notices that.
I and others here wish you luck on your journey.
BUT,.a piece of advice along the way...
JUST LISTEN,.AS SIMPLY AS THAT

PS: The picture is from my headphone- system

 

[Stebbo]

Peder, you are a fantasist.
You do with your system whatever you want. I really don’t care.
You are/were one of those types that uses, in particular order. Shataki stones, cable lifters, Ravioli feet, ‘audio fuses’ and the green pen around your CDs. Not forgetting demagnetising the disc itself.
I will leave you to carry on howling at the moon.

 

[SchiitMjolnir2]

OK,.so what I hear in my own music system,with my own ears,you rudely choose to just ignore.
DESPITE,.my experience,which I only slightly touched on in previous posts.

With your statement,.so I assume you have listened yourself.
IF NOT,.well then you embarrass yourself even more,.and just appear like a clown..!!
ESPECIALLY,.when you are so rude here on InnuO's own forum.
-------------------------------------------------------------
I wonder if @Stephen Healy wants to
comment on anything.
Personally,.I completely understand if
he doesn't.
-------------------------------------------------------------
How many times do you think we,.and I suppose InnuOs have read the same nonsense.
This from "the technical" narrow-minded people who walk around with their blinders on.

AND,.in your case,that you don't even hear a difference in sound quality between two quality ethernet-cables...

THAT,.says a lot about what level you are at.

You still have a lot to learn about high-quality music-systems,.everyone here who takes part in your argument probably notices that.
I and others here wish you luck on your journey.
BUT,.a piece of advice along the way...
JUST LISTEN,.AS SIMPLY AS THAT

PS: The picture is from my headphone- system

You can't fix ignorant. It's like they're stuck with General Physics/Chemistry/Math and can't understand that some of those topics they learned are a bunch of assumptions and ideal cases that upper/deeper level of Physics/Chemistry/Math shows that it's not how the concepts of general/intro STEM concept really works in reality/real life, and that a lot of them are just approximations

We don't have any discussion if one has already preconceived notion of audiophile is snake oil BS, then make an analogy of amateurish works of audio mastering engineer that makes those awfully mastered mainstream music (not the legendary ones like the Octave Records or Yarlung or David Chesky Recods; and yes all three use true SOTA gears (REAL SOTA performing equipment not the ones defined by your Holy AP555B Analyzer)

 

[SchiitMjolnir2]

I don’t care to be honest.
I know the reclocker is snake oil. It has been confirmed with extensive testing over on ASR. It goes against a mature technology that has been in use for years.

I think this sums it up nicely. A quote from a guy on another forum.

Middle-aged hi-fi people with disposable income, too much time on their hands and a ropey understanding of the technology enjoy finding solutions to non-existent problems.

It's okay to keep drinking Amir's kool aid. But don't go here spouting your pseudoscience cult of misinterpreted science about audio quality

 

[SchiitMjolnir2]

Middle-aged hi-fi people with disposable income, too much time on their hands and a ropey understanding of the technology enjoy finding solutions to non-existent problems.

LOL. You're really far, far away from reality. It's okay to be stuck in Amir's Matrix world of pseudoscience. I don't disagree that it feels really good for you and your soul if I put myself in your shoes.

 

[Peder]

You can't fix ignorant.

That's right,.they are just embarrassing when they show their ignorance.

Even though I said earlier,.that we have many incredibly technically knowledgeable people in our Hifi and Music Association, two of whom are professors in this field...
So @Stebbo continues to embarrass himself.
Fascinating.....

 

[Peder]

Peder, you are a fantasist.
You do with your system whatever you want. I really don’t care.
You are/were one of those types that uses, in particular order. Shataki stones, cable lifters, Ravioli feet, ‘audio fuses’ and the green pen around your CDs. Not forgetting demagnetising the disc itself.
I will leave you to carry on howling at the moon.

Is this drivel above worth commenting on..?
NO,.it sounds like a playhouse for toddlers.

 

[Stebbo]

 

[Peder]

YOUNGER THAN WE THOUGHT

@SchiitMjolnir2 ,.when you thought @Stebbo couldn't embarrass himself any more...
Yes,.then he posts these childish things on InnuO's serious forum .

I wrote earlier that he is probably young, but with this post above,we can probably conclude that he is younger than we thought.

Stebbo,.you can engage in such childish behavior on your ASR forum, absolutely not on InnuO's own forum.
/Peder

 

[SchiitMjolnir2]

YOUNGER THAN WE THOUGHT

@SchiitMjolnir2 ,.when you thought @Stebbo couldn't embarrass himself any more...
Yes,.then he posts these childish things on InnuO's serious forum .

I wrote earlier that he is probably young, but with this post above,we can probably conclude that he is younger than we thought.

Stebbo,.you can engage in such childish behavior on your ASR forum, absolutely not on InnuO's own forum.
/Peder

Yes. I'm probably stereotyping on what I'm about to express. I think he has some sort of inferiority complex that he gets dopamine rush on people that spend their hard earned money on things he wouldn't even consider purchasing because of preconceived bias as well as inferiority complex.

I myself don't have the TOTL system but I do appreciate the experience of what esoteric/unique implementation brings to the table as it shows genuine R&D at work

 

[Peder]

I myself don't have the TOTL system but I do appreciate the experience of what esoteric/unique implementation brings to the table as it shows genuine R&D at work

You put it well ...

As I see it,.we are all here to learn from each other, and each other's experiences.
----------------------------------------------------------------
NOT,.to mock and insult what we have no
practical knowledge or experience of.
----------------------------------------------------------------
AND,.what I've learned through decades in this interest is...
That no matter how much we speculate technically,.it's completely irrelevant.
It's how a product practically delivers in a music-system that matters.
AND,.then we get to the incredibly important topic...
Installing and optimizing a music-system,.but that's a topic for a separate thread .

I consider myself to have extensive experience with music-systems,.despite that I am constantly learning new things, this by sharing experiences on various forums, among other things.
We have all taken different paths in this interest,.this is what makes it interesting, not how expensive and exclusive our music-system is.

BECAUSE,.no matter how exclusive our music-system is, there is always someone who has a more exclusive one.

Then this InnuOs forum is also very special,.this because we always have knowledgeable representatives from InnuOs to ask for advice.
We should be very grateful for that,.and it is something I value very much.
SO,.Thank You...
@Stephen Healy
@DanCollier
And all the others I've seen here on the forum from InnuOs .

 

[frank7036]

@Stephen Healy , time to lock this thread and do some housekeeping with posts.

 

[mikehughescq]

I’m going to echo the above to @Stephen Healy but, before the thread is inevitably closed,I think it’s worth all concerned noting a few things.

1 - there are multiple manufacturer forums on which people post an initial post asking for comments on an ASR review of a product by that manufacturer. The pattern is that the OP posts the one post and then disappears. Go read the first post on this thread and ask yourself what happened to the OP. There is a somewhat suspicious pattern of activity/methodology with these things.

2 - ASR is, irrefutably, at best, a divisive site. It is simply not worth engaging with that division. The pattern is very predictable. OP posts then disappears and then comes the follow up from an “expert”. Any affiliation with ASR is hard to prove but always denied. It all becomes about “science” and “engineering” versus everyone else where everyone else is an idiot.

3- the fact that a certain amount of expertise resides within ASR is irrefutable. What’s also true is that some of the methodology and many of the assumptions behind that have been challenged. Regardless of where you sit on that it’s irrefutably both toxic and a dead end.

4 - most sane people will accept that measurements are useful for manufacturers and indicative of the kind of sound one might see result from use of certain products but that’s it. There is no objective truth of “if this measures good then it is great and if it doesn’t then it’s not. No amount of pontificating or “alleged” proof will ever change that it’s your ears and your judgement.

I own a product which ASR claimed was reviewed so subjectively that it rendered a well known publication irrelevant. I am aware of its main specs. It is the finest piece of hifi I have owned. A “keeper” if you’ll indulge me. The two subjective reviews I read, one of which was hammered by ASR, gave me more relevant and accurate information than ASR. Nevertheless it was interesting to read the ASR perspective. Sadly, ASR advocates believe there’s a need to take sides. There really isn’t. I find the contributions of @Stebbo on here both unhelpful in tone and aggression and wonder what they think will be achieved.

Wild guess will be “nothing”.

 

[frank7036]

Unfortunately there are issues from both sides of the discussion, I have not yet seen a thread on any audio forum that includes subjective & objective aficionados end in anything other than bickering.
If one side dig their heels in, so does the other.
And on it goes, forcing moderators to get involved and ultimately locking of threads.

 

[Peder]

I find the contributions of @Stebbo

And @frank7036...
It is incredibly rude to open a thread on InnuOs own forum,.and accuse InnuOs of manufacturing "Snake Oil" products.

If you behave like that,.well then at least I am a man that stand up and confronts that kind of nonsense...
And also @SchiitMjolnir2 .

BUT,.now Stebbo seems to have disappeared, so we can return to the topic of the thread, to seriously exchange experiences regarding InnuO's Phoenix USB reclocker .

THEN,.I have a question for you frank7036.
You wrote earlier that you probably wouldn't buy an InnuOs Phoenix USB reclocker today,.even though you had one earlier.

Is it because you think it's too expensive, or that you thought the increase in sound quality was too small.?

 

[frank7036]

Hi @Peder
My issue isn’t with @Stebbo bringing up the ASR review , Innuos make a big deal about their products but with little measured performance data to back it up. They are (or should be) big enough to stand criticism and provide better than “it’s all subjective” as a rebuttal.
@Stebbo way of making it personal wasn’t good, but I also think the subjective viewpoint wasn’t well prosecuted either.
Also, nowhere did Innuos actually make any meaningful input. That’s enough of this.

PheonixUSB
I still own one , but yes, if I were to be considering one today I would be much more thorough in my examination of its perceived performance.
I have previously stated in these forums (perhaps this thread?) that it is the way the DAC processes incoming data that determines whether the PheonixUSB makes a discernible difference or not.
I also know that sighted reviews (and especially if you have already purchased ) or comparisons are knowingly biased, so I would/do encourage prospective buyers get a loaner box, or borrow one then put effort into making comparisons over several days , preferably blind tests. Without influence from other Pheonix owners or owners of these type of product.
A lot of ppl don’t want to go this far. I understand that, it’s hard work. But at the end of the day it’s the buyers money and they will do what they want.

 

[Peder]

A lot of ppl don’t want to go this far. I understand that, it’s hard work

Hi Frank ...

I test and evaluate everything very carefully in my system before adding a new product.
My system is incredibly matched with "Attention To Detail",.so the slightest change can go wrong if I don't evaluate a new product carefully.

Personally,.I'm happy with my InnuOs USB reclocker,.but the total cost is quite high.
I have two Vertere Redline USB cables,.costing a total of $1620 connected to it.

And a Jorma Design Duality powercable with upgraded Oyaide P/C 004 connectors,.costing $1960.

SO,.all together it's a lot of money.

Would I make the same total investment today Frank,.quite honestly,I'm not sure.

 

[frank7036]

@Peder
Yes costs always seem to climb.
I’m using Tubulus Concentus cable for i2s and Sablon EVO USB along with other well regarded interconnects from preamp to amps. A sizeable investment.
It is all very dependent on what is available in your neighbourhood, what your system is as a whole and what as an individual you are willing to pursue.
Now, at retirement I’m somewhat less likely to simply jump on board and try something than I used to be.
I’m also evaluating my system for the next decade. I’m playing less vinyl (although I have a very good vinyl setup) , using my stored digital library, purchasing digital files (both 16/44, hi-res PCM and DSD64 and upto 256) over cd/sacd and beginning to stream music from Qobuz. It will shape my purchases going forward.
Lots of interesting stuff coming through the pipeline for digital. Perhaps in another thread
we can discuss some of the aspects of systems that are not necessarily Innuos. Wishing you good listening into the future.