System Pics anyone interested?
- Thread starter stepdol
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Are you using the 30 cm. umbilicals? Curios to know how higher the streamer chassis can be lifted from the supply chassis. Did you notice a different sound compared to having them stacked?
Hi
...I wrote the following comment in another thread regarding your question.
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But please Dan...You can't seriously give that advice,.and at the same time aspire to be a "high-end company" with Attention To Detail as its guiding principle.
For example:Hifi-salesman Björn Wiman at Akkelis Audio in Gothenburg, Sweden.
He had stacked his InnuOs Statement NG.
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I told him,."you can't install your Statement streamer like that if you want maximum sound quality."
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Björn followed my advice and placed his Statement NG on two separate shelves.
Afterwards he thanked me,.for the better sound quality he got with this placement.
Consensus: Never Stack Devices If You Want to Achieve the Highest Possible Sound Quality From Your Music System.I'm using the cords that it came with. They are long enough to have on separate shelves although mine aren't very high. I have only had like this so can't say what the difference may be
Hi again
...Both InnuOs and Chord have longer cords if you need them.
Björn Wiman,.who I mentioned earlier, uses Chords.
Thanks for your post, curious to know @Nuno and @Stephen Healy opinion on that stacked non-stacked difference.
As for umbilicals I’m using 30 cm long Mundorf type made on request by Sean Jacobs - price apart - I was told that the shorter the better, so I’d like to gain both the benefits, separate shelves and short (higher quality) umbilicals.
If anyone has had direct experience with their own system/Statement/set up, I would appreciate further comments.
As for umbilicals I’m using 30 cm long Mundorf type made on request by Sean Jacobs - price apart - I was told that the shorter the better, so I’d like to gain both the benefits, separate shelves and short (higher quality) umbilicals.
If anyone has had direct experience with their own system/Statement/set up, I would appreciate further comments.
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Hi again..???
I have given you my comment based on my own experience and system installation.
As well as my advice to a well-known high-end person and hi-fi seller in Sweden.
Why do you need Stephens and Nuno's opinions in general..??
My advice to you is to listen for yourself based on the advice I and the other guy have given you.
Take my advice and listen for yourself, as simple as that
.Thanks Peder for sharing your personal opinion, with all due respect I trust and had several useful recommendations from Nuno and Stephen, owner-founder and sales manager of Innuos. Why am I asking their opinion after your post? Because I suppose you aren’t more qualified than them about Innuos product, maybe?
I agree with you the final judgement should come from my ears. And I certainly want to go that route sooner or later. To try them separately I need a complete rearrangement of my entire rack (Solidsteel) = a big challenge in time and effort for me. This is the reason why I’m asking if it’s worth the effort.
I agree with you the final judgement should come from my ears. And I certainly want to go that route sooner or later. To try them separately I need a complete rearrangement of my entire rack (Solidsteel) = a big challenge in time and effort for me. This is the reason why I’m asking if it’s worth the effort.
Hi again
...Of course Nuno and Stephen know their products best.
BUT,.this is not about their products,it's about music-system installation and optimization.
AND,.what I mention about stacking products applies to ALL products, regardless of brand.
I personally have a lot of experience installing music-systems for others.
Many people around Sweden have hired me to install and optimize their music systems.
I have also been a hi-fi dealer,.and also started a large Music and Hi-fi organization, which became known all over Sweden.
In that organization we also carried out a lot of tests and evaluations of products, and in all contexts the musical quality was worse from stacking products.
Then as I said,.both InnuOs,Chord and also Sean Jacobs have longer cables to use between the Statement units...
Which of these who fits best in your system you might be able to borrow and evaluate for yourself
.
But it is about their products. Innuos to date have marketed and demoed the Statement as a stacked solution. I'm with @luca.pelliccioli on this one, what is the view of Innuos ? I'm aware of what Nuno/Innuos have said to date, I have no knowledge of yourself or your role in Swedish Hifi.Hi again
Of course Nuno and Stephen know their products best.
BUT,.this is not about their products,it's about music-system installation and optimization.
AND,.what I mention about stacking products applies to ALL products, regardless of brand.
I personally have a lot of experience installing music-systems for others.
Many people around Sweden have hired me to install and optimize their music systems.
I have also been a hi-fi dealer,.and also started a large Music and Hi-fi organization, which became known all over Sweden.
In that organization we also carried out a lot of tests and evaluations of products, and in all contexts the musical quality was worse from stacking products.
Then as I said,.both InnuOs,Chord and also Sean Jacobs have longer cables to use between the Statement units...
Which of these who fits best in your system you might be able to borrow and evaluate for yourself
Hi, I'm happy to chime in on this. There's a number of variables to consider but essentially it's about vibration on the chassis. The stacked approach means the power supply gets a "damper" on top which does help with vibration. There's no real impact in terms of the toroidal as there's enough distance and metal between the Power Box and Server box to render the influence mute.
Now it does depend if you want to use more specific isolation shelves that are very good at mid to high frequency vibration.
Summing up, there's no ideal generic configuration - it depends a lot on your setup. My view is that stacked normally will provide more benefits in most rack situations but very specialised rack/isolation shelves/feet might flip this around.
Hope this helps.
Nuno
The important stuff! A central managed switch (Unifi USW-24 PoE: the big rectangular box) and a network controller (Unifi UXG-Lite: the mini little white box) to create a VLAN for the hifi. Two other devices on the hifi VLAN: a Mac Mini running HQ Player and Roon Server and a Buffalo network drive for my music library. 25m fibre optic goes to the hifi, the media conversion to CAT6a by a TPLink MC200CM (SC connector, no transceiver required), powered by a SoTM 9v battery pack. No hifi switching, no mains, no hassle.
Supplied in the UK by broadbandbuyer.com, who configure the Ubiquiti products before delivery and manage them thereafter.
Feeds a Pulsar, I previously had the same arrangement with a Zen Mk3 without the VLAN.
I use it in HQ Player Endpoint mode, which requires Roon as a controller. As I prefer Sense, sometimes I switch to Sense Standalone mode.
For a while I used the Pulsar with the Zen Mk3 in Sense Endpoint mode, I must admit it did not sound any better, so eventually I sold the Mk3.
Supplied in the UK by broadbandbuyer.com, who configure the Ubiquiti products before delivery and manage them thereafter.
Feeds a Pulsar, I previously had the same arrangement with a Zen Mk3 without the VLAN.
I use it in HQ Player Endpoint mode, which requires Roon as a controller. As I prefer Sense, sometimes I switch to Sense Standalone mode.
For a while I used the Pulsar with the Zen Mk3 in Sense Endpoint mode, I must admit it did not sound any better, so eventually I sold the Mk3.
I’ve found it incredibly valuable to downsize as I moved to streaming and then experiment one component at a time rather than buying into the “networks are complex and noisy so you must have…” orthodoxy. Thus far I have discovered that despite a noisy mains there is no benefit in my system in having a switch. Literally none of them make any difference e beyond occupying a socket and a space on the floor. Have also discovered that, whilst ethernet filters or fibre optic can have impressive results in terms of background noise levels, the impact on the music is subtle and not necessarily consistent across genres, resolutions and much more. There are many reviews which exert the exact opposite perspective. Having tried eight devices so far one can only wonder how extensive the listening. Without wishing to denigrate or single out one product, a friend loaned me a small device at the cheaper end of the market because he could discern no negative impact and had used several across his system. Initially very very impressive, after five days I found that it times appallingly on stripped down acoustic music - think 360 Degrees by Waxahatchee for one example - and made it seem slow and that the singer couldn’t hear the music.
So, at this point. nothing is “essential” for me beyond Innuos source, DAC, amp and speakers.
So, at this point. nothing is “essential” for me beyond Innuos source, DAC, amp and speakers.
I started streaming with a Linn DS in 2010 and they took the decision that, for audio quality, the music source had to be from a network driver and not a usb-connected drive. Their streamer/DACs only had a ethernet input. Innuos have the same approach. That was before online streaming, so I got into using a network storage drive and have done ever since. That necessitates a switch, best placed next to the modem.
I have both fibre and copper ethernet cables installed in trunking from the hi-fi to the modem (the modem is on a different floor of the house) and I don’t notice any difference in sound quality. I use the fibre for the hi-fi for other reasons. When using long runs of copper ethernet cable, RJ45 connectors can get damaged and can be a pain in the neck to replace. I’ve done it myself with a crimping tool, but you need an equally long cable to connect to the other end to do a continuity test.
If there is one thing that might possibly be worth using, it’s an in-line ethernet filter. These were invented by EMO Systems in Germany and have been in use for many years, mainly for medical and professional audio equipment. I bought one on eBay for £50. There is a cheaper one from DeLock that cost about £25 on Amazon and lots of audio accessory companies do them, mostly for equivalent prices, with one or two doing them at stratospheric prices.
Personally, having done a lot of research on the audiophile switch business, it seems a complete con, with large amounts of products costing hundreds or thousands of pounds, all of which are based on commercial products that cost £25-£50. I’ve read about people saying they use three switches in series, so three switches, three power supplies, endless cables. Crazy.
I need a fairly sophisticated Ubiquiti switch (cost £300) because I have a lot of home automation, about 100 active IP addresses and four access points (all wired and powered by PoE). that switch does almost everything, I do have one other small £25 switch in the AV department because I need to connect the TV to the satellite box and an Apple TV box.
Innuos servers actually have an internal switch, hence the two ethernet sockets. I don’t know how many people use them both, but it’s a useful facility. I used it when I had two Innuos devices in use and was using my main unit as a sense endpoint.
The space I save from keeping the digital simple is used by an analog system that comprises a turntable, two phono stages and a power supply for the turntable, plus a power supply for one of the phono stages. It’s a ridiculous number of boxes to play records, but analog and digital systems should be considered entirely separate pastimes.
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